UGN Security

Help Wanted!!

Posted By: RedArrow

Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 01:23 AM

Hi guys,as u can guess i am a complete norman newbie and havent got the first idea how to hack/crack/phreak.But i wud like to start learnin and i was wondering if there was ne1 who had a bit of time on their hands who could give me a few tips of what they read and what their choice of programs are.If ne1 is interested in taking on an apprentice then please leave a message.Ne help would be much appreciated.

Posted By: paradox

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 02:43 AM

Sure i will.. i got plenty of time on my hands.. Number one rule though is that you will search for the infromation before you ask about it.. and no that doesnt mean in google you type "search" and click im feeling lucky
Posted By: pergesu

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 04:03 AM

I'm willing to take on an apprentice, if you're willing to pay for an apprenticeship
Posted By: Nem2k

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 04:10 AM

They'll teach you the good way, young padawan
Posted By: Ntd

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 06:41 AM

Goto and read up on some RFC's (Request for Comments, they explain different internet protocols) and also learn a programming language, since i am assuming that you are on a windows box, i surgest that you learn VB-script since you don't need a compliere and can use notepad also HTML is good as well.
Posted By: paradox

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 09:09 AM

telling someone to learn vb-script as a first language is pointless :|, telling them to learn vb is pointless fullstop. They need something that can be portable.. you don't want them to be stuck having to use windows and not venturing out into the real world.. but only the world the corporate demon ms wants you to go into..
secondly you can't just point someone to a link and say learn this. It never works.. You have to find out what they want to focus on first of all.. then point them in the right direction to get the infromation that will aide in the learning process
and pay for an apprenticeship lol.. the employer is suppose to give people an apprenticeship and pay them below minimum wage in 90% of the cases
Posted By: Ntd

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 11:51 AM

Well since Microsoft is on a large majority of computers VB could be considered portable and powerful since learning C/C++ with-out any programing experience would be very difficult and point-less, And if he didn't have a complier what would he do? "You have to find out what they want to focus on first of all.. " he wants to hack/crack and he can't do that with out understanding the protocols.
Posted By: jonconley

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/08/03 03:48 PM

I think he means portable as being ported to other platforms. Whereas, VB isn't able to run on other platforms. However, there is a .NET project to run .NET applications on linux, which may eventually help.

Back to the topic, I would not aim so largely, find an area that intrigues you and focus on that until you know it like the back of your hand. You will be amazed how principles crossapply to other subjects and how much will overlap as you go along.
Posted By: paradox

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/09/03 03:22 AM

"Back to the topic, I would not aim so largely, find an area that intrigues you and focus on that until you know it like the back of your hand. You will be amazed how principles crossapply to other subjects and how much will overlap as you go along." quoted from jon conely thats what i meant by
"You have to find out what they want to focus on first of all.. " Hacking/cracking is to broad a range.. you can say you want to crack programs.. you want to crack webservers.. you can't be a jack of all trades.. you have to diversify, thats why most groups have specialist in different areas of hacking.. and c++ is just as difficult as vb. but its easily ported to other OS's and jon conelly is right with the .NET thing being portable..
Well RedArrow can choose a mentor.. there are enough valid points here to make a decision lol
Posted By: PuffballsRevenge

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/26/03 08:47 AM

Im still a newb myself so I only have a limited amount of advice, but when I started to learn to "hack",all I wanted to do was try to get into computersa and crack passwords adn other programs. That is a horrible way to start to learn. My best suggestion to you is to, lean programming languages, start with something easy where you dont need a compiler. HTML would be a great start, very easy to learn, and you see results fast. Then move on to a scripting lagnuage where you also dont need a compiler, but has a closer structure to actual programming like Java Script, it would help you learn acutall programmign stucture and allows you to build of your HTML experience. After that I suggest to go into Visual Basic, it is an easy language to learn, but it really gets you into the feel of programming, its a bit slower to see results but its worth it for what comes next. Once your comfterable with Visual Basic move on to C++. This can be a hard language to learn, and you will be happy that you took the time to learn those others languages, to help you with it. This is a great steps to take I think, it takes a long time, but you cant expect to learn to hack over night. Dont stop with these tho keep going, learn other languages, master different OS like linux/unix, and always read.
Posted By: jonconley

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/27/03 12:40 AM

Puffball has his points however, I would like to make a few counterclaims. Of no offense to you personally.

I would disagree on learning HTML. HTML is more of a simple Markup Language than an actual programming language. Therefore you don't really gain any computer/network knowledge that crossapplies. HTML deals with itself and doesn't require any knowledge or learning on any other point. However, as it sounds like you know, other programming languages will require you to learn more about how computers work, how networks work, etc. It doesn't hurt to learn it, but will not help his goal.

Now, I don't disagree on the scripting aspect instead of going with a compiler, but I do not think languages needing to be compiled, add too much of a learning curve simply for that reason.

I think learning VB before C++ will add difficulty and create habits that will actually hinder the ability to quickly adapt to C++. I do not feel as though they build off each other. I only know a small amount of both from classes, so perhaps someone who is familar with both can offer some more specific insight on the pros/cons of going from one to the other.

If you want to stick with windows, don't bother learning a *script. VB is easy enough to get a hold on, that you could just start out with that.

If you plan on learning linux, then there are a plethora of languages to choose from.

If you want to learn C++, just start learning C++. I read a tutorial on someone learning one language to make it easier to learn C++, and I didn't see much of a point. I will probably stand to be corrected, but that happens alot smile
Posted By: smartyhands

Re: Help Wanted!! - 09/27/03 05:21 AM

I agree with PuffBall about learning HTML, I know it's only markup but there *are* valid lessons for total newbies. A lot of the folks on the board have been in the industry for so long that the memory of total ignorance has faded...

Aside from that point (and one more), I totally agree with jonconley, because the first few steps are FREE and available to anyone with a window$ box and a browser - you can write your own HTML, and eventually scripts, with notepad and see the results immediately. HTML is an excellent springboard for people who are not familiar with the abstraction of computer languages.

It also introduces newbies to the very important art of debugging.

jonconley also sez:
I do not think languages needing to be compiled, add too much of a learning curve...

I think this really depends on the knowledge base you start out with. I have (started to) read several INTRODUCTORY C++ books that began with how to confiugure the makefiles to compile the package and such, which is daunting and looks like total gibberish to newbs.

Just note that using a fancy compiler IS a seperate learning curve from learning the language itself. I don't really disagree with jonconley on this point, I just wanted to clarify.


Ah, |=uck it, you want to learn about computers, just go learn asm, it can do EVERYTHING that ANY OTHER language can, and MORE, and FASTER! You can have COMPLETE CONTROL over any processor or program!
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